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Post by betterweather1239 on Nov 10, 2016 12:27:46 GMT -7
I too have a happier work place, which in turn has made me angrier.
The nightmares of rural Ohio.
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Post by saulgoodman on Nov 10, 2016 12:32:23 GMT -7
When it all boils down, I'm much less angry about his actual victory than the state of US society. You can't fault the guy for convincing the uneducated, disenfranchised lowest common denominator to vote for him. It's the fact that the ugliness now has a voice that bothers me the most. That and the fact that his Supreme Court nomination that will haunt us for decades. The people who took to the streets to protest a man who won the election is ludicrous. Their energy should've been directed at Capitol Hill and that mutant Mitch McConnell for pulling the unprecedented move of blocking a nominee to the Supreme Court. These are my sentiments almost down to the letter. In fact, for my part, when I realized that HRC was (very likely) going to win the popular vote, I felt at least a little cold comfort about the whole thing. At least the majority of voters did not embrace Trump and given the nature of his campaign, that was about as important to me as actually keeping him out of the oval office itself. I guess I'd take minor difference from you in that I don't find the protestors ludicrous exactly. I do find the notion that he is "not our president" highly ludicrous however. And, I agree with you wholeheartedly that that energy would have been more effective if pointed to the blocking of a legit S.Ct. nominee. but the everyday voter just don't vote everyday, unfortunately. What I do find heartbreaking is not that the republicans will be in charge. I very much disagree with the sentiment that it doesn't matter which one of the major 2 parties are in charge, but some of my best friends are republicans and we see eye to eye on plenty. What's upsetting to me is remembering John McCain correcting that lady at his rally that wanted to call Obama a muslim traitor. He corrected her and took the high ground, and what's sad to me is to see that that, not riling up that way of thinking, very well may have cost an actual worthy candidate the election vis a vis Trump. I'm not proposing that that is all that there was to Trump's campaign; that "forgotten man and woman" have legit problems that extend beyond those that stem from bigotry. Just the same, Trump was willing to get out voters by utilizing methods and attitudes that McCain would not, and that's bodes ill for our political future to say the least. The upshot is that I think it will only bode ill for the short term. The "hidden Trump vote", thankfully, has foreseeable expiration date. |
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Post by lordkundalini on Nov 10, 2016 12:39:12 GMT -7
i certainly agree that on a personal level the various parties may affect you differently if that matters to you.
the various policy differences dont change my life by any way i care about at this point. so its easy for me to focus on the big picture, systemic structural changes
but in the area of corporate take over of American, the unsaistiable war machine budget, the sell out of the FDA, the EPA ect
the unwillingness to clean up corruption, get rid of undue influence of lobbyists ect. and especially the manifestation of the police state
i see little effective difference in the parties from that perspective
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Post by PooDolla on Nov 10, 2016 12:39:58 GMT -7
lol
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Post by betterweather1239 on Nov 10, 2016 12:45:45 GMT -7
When it all boils down, I'm much less angry about his actual victory than the state of US society. You can't fault the guy for convincing the uneducated, disenfranchised lowest common denominator to vote for him. It's the fact that the ugliness now has a voice that bothers me the most. That and the fact that his Supreme Court nomination that will haunt us for decades. The people who took to the streets to protest a man who won the election is ludicrous. Their energy should've been directed at Capitol Hill and that mutant Mitch McConnell for pulling the unprecedented move of blocking a nominee to the Supreme Court. These are my sentiments almost down to the letter. In fact, for my part, when I realized that HRC was (very likely) going to win the popular vote, I felt at least a little cold comfort about the whole thing. At least the majority of voters did not embrace Trump and given the nature of his campaign, that was about as important to me as actually keeping him out of the oval office itself. I guess I'd take minor difference from you in that I don't find the protestors ludicrous exactly. I do find the notion that he is "not our president" highly ludicrous however. And, I agree with you wholeheartedly that that energy would have been more effective if pointed to the blocking of a legit S.Ct. nominee. but the everyday voter just don't vote everyday, unfortunately. What I do find heartbreaking is not that the republicans will be in charge. I very much disagree with the sentiment that it doesn't matter which one of the major 2 parties are in charge, but some of my best friends are republicans and we see eye to eye on plenty. What's upsetting to me is remembering John McCain correcting that lady at his rally that wanted to call Obama a muslim traitor. He corrected her and took the high ground, and what's sad to me is to see that that, not riling up that way of thinking, very well may have cost an actual worthy candidate the election vis a vis Trump. I'm not proposing that that is all that there was to Trump's campaign; that "forgotten man and woman" have legit problems that extend beyond those that stem from bigotry. Just the same, Trump was willing to get out voters by utilizing methods and attitudes that McCain would not, and that's bodes ill for our political future to say the least. The upshot is that I think it will only bode ill for the short term. The "hidden Trump vote", thankfully, has foreseeable expiration date. Ludicrous might be a bit heavy. Misguided might be more appropriate. I do agree too that it does matter who is in control of the three branches of government. No side is likely to make irreversible changes will in control, but change is a slow process. Undoing change is even slower. I find the Republican position in the 21st century to be unbelievably short sighted. While they had similar political control under W II they tried to pass anti-filibuster legislation in the House, I believe, in order to fulfill their agenda. The fact that elected officials were unable to see how they would be on the inverse blows my mind. It was never enacted, but in my opinion it draws parallels to dragging these Trumpers out of the cesspool in this election. They won the battle but lost the political war. Good luck appeasing the base you now rely on with anything other than the populist non-sense of this campaign. |
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Post by betterweather1239 on Nov 10, 2016 12:50:41 GMT -7
By my count that is the fourth time in the last 50 years the GOP has pulled in a base by politicizing issues that the uneducated care about. And then somehow year after year they are able to convince these people to vote GOP even though it's against their own economic and social interests.
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Post by lordkundalini on Nov 10, 2016 12:53:42 GMT -7
just read this from my fav musician
Mark Murphy--wookiefoot
1 hr ·
Like many of you, my heart has been so heavy for the past couple of days… in a haze of not knowing what to think or feel… weaving through sadness, fear, anger, denial…on and on in a loop. And then I realized something…
I can do two things at the same time.
I can be really, really depressed and still find a glimmer of hope for loving people to rally together as a community. I can be really terrified of the potential chaos that could unfold and at the same time be really inspired to do whatever it takes to prevent that. I can stand on one foot and eat a sandwich!
I can do two things at the same time!
I can feel like the world just ended and that the world is just beginning. I can see the hatred and rage burning in their eyes, and also try to find empathy for a marginalized and declining massive population that had no real representation in government would be extremely susceptible to racism. I can see pandemic of xenophobia infecting our population like a super virus, and yet simultaneously know that to reduce all of opponents down to “bigots” would be to miss a simple truth. Everyone is afraid. I can ride my bike and flap my arms at the same time.
I can do two things at the same time.
I can feel the rage in my own heart, and at the same time know that this is the worst fuel to use in my own engine of activism… the exhaust is horrible and unsustainable! I can completely mistrust the character and intentions of the new president elect and his cabinet of clowns, yet hope with all my heart that I am totally wrong. I can activate with this community to hold this new administration to account like never before in history, to resist them with everything we’ve got on any of their unethical or unconstitutional actions, and do it the whole time with a sincere smile on my face while singing. I can surf and recite poetry at the same time!
I can do two things at the same time!!!
I can really want to be part of the liberal circular firing squad that always happens at moments of defeat… to blame the part of coalition that we think didn’t do their part… all sides at each other’s throats. I can really want to be a part of that, but at the same time know this is not the road we need to walk to reconstruct our country. I can have tears in my eyes and breathe deeply at the same time.
I can love my enemy.
I can love my enemy and still oppose them at the same time.
The only thing I can’t do at the same time is laugh and be afraid.
So I’m gonna laugh!
Roll up your sleeves my friends! There’s much work to be done! Just remember to work and laugh at the same time!
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Post by saulgoodman on Nov 10, 2016 12:57:20 GMT -7
i certainly agree that on a personal level the various parties may affect you differently if that matters to you. the various policy differences dont change my life by any way i care about at this point. so its easy for me to focus on the big picture, systemic structural changes but in the area of corporate take over of American, the unsaistiable war machine budget, the sell out of the FDA, the EPA ect the unwillingness to clean up corruption, get rid of undue influence of lobbyists ect. and especially the manifestation of the police state i see little effective difference in the parties from that perspective I don't expect to change your mind, and I don't even intend to. I also hate to play the 'insider' card because you and many, many others have just as valid an opinion on the police state as I do. But, I can't not say this: as someone who works with police and on police issues 5 or more days a week, I promise you there is a clear, decisive difference in the way the 2 major parties are responding to the manifestation of the police state. The dems are far better at repudiating the police state--far, far, far better! The good news for me on that front is that dems took back control of one of the houses of the legislature in New Mexico this election. I probably agree with you on the war machine and lobbyist influence issues. |
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Post by Don Swifty on Nov 10, 2016 13:02:29 GMT -7
Just read a story citing the Russian Foreign Deputy Minister confirming that the Trump campaign was in contact with the Russian government during the campaign and that Putin has ordered that Trump have his transition team put the resumes of those fluent in Russian at the top of the pile to make orders communications from Moscow to DC that much easier. Putin's letting everyone know who's in charge by deciding what the common language is going to be.
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Post by lordkundalini on Nov 10, 2016 13:07:00 GMT -7
i certainly agree that on a personal level the various parties may affect you differently if that matters to you. the various policy differences dont change my life by any way i care about at this point. so its easy for me to focus on the big picture, systemic structural changes but in the area of corporate take over of American, the unsaistiable war machine budget, the sell out of the FDA, the EPA ect the unwillingness to clean up corruption, get rid of undue influence of lobbyists ect. and especially the manifestation of the police state i see little effective difference in the parties from that perspective I don't expect to change your mind, and I don't even intend to. I also hate to play the 'insider' card because you and many, many others have just as valid an opinion on the police state as I do. But, I can't not say this: as someone who works with police and on police issues 5 or more days a week, I promise you there is a clear, decisive difference in the way the 2 major parties are responding to the manifestation of the police state. The dems are far better at repudiating the police state--far, far, far better! The good news for me on that front is that dems took back control of one of the houses of the legislature in New Mexico this election. I probably agree with you on the war machine and lobbyist influence issues. that may be.. but the police state kept a rolling with Obama to my knowledge he did not repeal the enemy combatant nonsense which is the smoking gun imo. you can be labeled an enemy combatant then you have no rights at all, citizen or not. this is specifically what i think of when i think of police state. i would agree that on the whole if you look at individual politicians and their specific views dems are better but if you look at what happens, i see little difference if that makes sense |
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Post by frododoknobo on Nov 10, 2016 13:08:36 GMT -7
He sounds like he voted for Hilary.
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Post by Lakai on Nov 10, 2016 13:11:40 GMT -7
i'm most angry, depressed about the fact that the issue of climate change is going to regress from, "what should we do about it?" to, "is science a real thing?"
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Post by lordkundalini on Nov 10, 2016 13:13:53 GMT -7
He sounds like he voted for Hilary. not sure but def sounds like he did not vote for Trump and is reeling from the Trump suprise i so love him. wookiefoot for life!!!! |
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Post by Don Swifty on Nov 10, 2016 13:21:45 GMT -7
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Post by bussit on Nov 10, 2016 13:28:24 GMT -7
What?? Trump won?!?!?  |
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Post by Don Swifty on Nov 10, 2016 13:29:51 GMT -7
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Post by Lakai on Nov 10, 2016 13:50:50 GMT -7
Giuliani is such a scumbag, remember the multiple times over 8 years before 9/11 that he ignored first responder requests for working radios? And then 200 fire fighters did not receive evacuation calls before the towers fell.
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Post by Not your moms 🌮 on Nov 10, 2016 14:01:49 GMT -7
I'm blaming retards. I was confused until last night. At the bar I met a drunken trump fan. According to him it was about our right to havr guns and be manly, take what we want, even pussy. A few of us tried to discuss logic with him. Of course that didn't work. When I asked what trump was gonna do to help farmers and feed people he flipped out. Started freaking about how he faught in Nam for me. I pointed out I didn't need anyone fighting for me and to get out of my face. He was way to close and now very angry. One more time he reminds me he fought for me only putting his finger on me quite aggressively. Then, for the first time in probably 20 years I pushed this drunken fuck onto his ass and was thanked by the waitress. Fuck. Either way. I find now it's just each minority gets a turn. GW was the rich spoiled brats, Obama is black, trump is mentally handicapped. Maybe next it will be Mexican, woman or thug. I'm hoping for wook.
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Post by bussit on Nov 10, 2016 14:03:17 GMT -7
And I know people must accidentally sit on their glasses from time to time but you have to get a new pair if your going to be on tv a lot.
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Post by saulgoodman on Nov 10, 2016 14:04:00 GMT -7
I see Lork. but it turns out you and I aren't exactly talking about the same thing in terms of the police state. Your concern appears to go the rights of political dissidents, and certainly that is important. But frankly, as important as that is, the number of people directly, negatively affected by stop-and-frisk and similar such policies are much greater than those affected by the patriot act and similar such laws/policies. In these day to day types of police activities, the dems and, more importantly, the judges and justices they nominate are far more constitutionally trustworthy.
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